Hunting? The Big Problem

[Kovu The Lion]

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
Hmm, not exactly. And it's not a conscious thing; a human hunter thinks, "There's a deer, let's kill it because that makes us real men!"

An animal hunter probably doesn't think much more than, "Food!"

Butchered post because this is a thread about hunting, Not furs, lets try and keep it that way

Theres a lot of Animals that do infact kill for fun, I'll have to look it up but I've seen National Geographics about it,

Some Animals attack Humans/animal for other reasons than that of "Food" too Most possibly due to intrusion on there lands or something...

But don't Lion's fight each other to see "who is the top dog?" and not for "Food"?

[Aurelian]

Originally posted by Kovu The Lion
This person, has been here for a Week, and knows EXACTLY, what happens on Lea, Every, Single, Time, Something, Happens, on this BOARDS.

Does that NOT show something? But really anyways.

Not trying to point you out bud, But you just said you couldn't lay your hand on another animal, if it was in self defence.

You want to acuse ME of not being able to read? Point out where Forest Freak said that he wouldn't shoot an animal in self defence. I went through all 5 of his posts, and in every one, he did just the opposite. He bragged about his love for hunting. he would kill an animal running for its life, never mind one trying to kill him. You know, attacks and insults tend to have a stronger effect when you don't turn around and do exacacly what you just spoke against.

I have read all of what was said many times, and still find it biased and degrading.
And I stand by what I said about furs and perverts. That hatred leading to generalizing is part of life though. I can't count how many times I have heard people refer to all German's as Nazis(Sorry Nathalie), and all Muslims and Arabs as Terrorists(Likewise, Pheonix).My favorite is when people acuse all Native Americans as being uncivilized and savage barbarians. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...


ANYWAY, without apologizing or or outbursting, I will simply drop out of the subjest now and pretend it never existed. This has gone two far as it is, and to many innosent bystanders have already been hurt, and Lea is not the place for World War 3.

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by Roquivo
German's as Nazis(Sorry Nathalie),

Oh lord, you know where Nathalie's from, right?

[Kovu The Lion]

I was not accusing your Roquivo, However stating that to people in General who blurt out on things in which they have no clue about, or assume things to be right when they are actually wrong. However if you wish to take it like that then do so, I can't change you opinion on me.

He may have not stated anything, But it is sad when a person comes to this forums to talk about his love of the lion king, But then gets BASHED OUT, on his OWN INTRODUCTION THREAD, because of SOMETHING he LIKES to do.

We all have likes and dislikes, and some people hate our likes, and some people like our dislikes, But to be thrown out upon on your own thread and to be made felt of like crap on the first day, when all you want to do is talk about a liking of yours?(in this case The Lion King) and your gone in 3 days because two members( you know who you are ) make him/her feel like crap because of something they do?

He may not have stated something like you said, but you could have kept your opinions to yourself, Easily getting your point out with saying a "Hi nice to meet you" and ignoring the rest, Other than PREACHING to him on what he does is bad,

I mean thats about the same as a Christian going up to a Athiest and telling him over and over he's going to hell? Who has the right to tell a person if what he does is right or wrong? As long as it's not breaking a law, Then I don't think it's wrong, Now is it?



Just had to state that.

Kovu

[Aurelian]

Originally posted by Nephilim
Oh lord, you know where Nathalie's from, right?

I am pretty sure she is from Denmark, but she told me herself that she is German, unless that is all in my head too.

KTL, hate to break it to you, but I AM Christian, and I DO believe that all Athiests are going to Hell. And yes, I do realize that for a Christian, I am pretty unorthodox.

I never bashed Forest Freak about liking hunting. The worst I did was submit my opinion about disliking trophies in a thread he was partisipating in. I actually told him he shouldn't feel forced out because of his opinion.

[Pnt]

Guys, can we please drop this? Every thread with a bit of intelligent discussion goes this way when an unpopular opinion is stated. There's just no point for that, this is the internet, it's really not worth getting that worked up about. Remember respect and maturity, and if there's going to be a discussion about who did what, please take it somewhere else. Please, this thread needs to get back on topic and re-establish a respectful atmosphere.

So, stating what I said before:


The one thing that really bugs me about hunting in this area is how irresponsible hunters can be. During their respective seasons, I'll see hunters closer than five feet from a road hunting with loaded guns. Granted, they're almost always pointing away from the highway, but I've always figured that a loaded gun being fired with 3-5 feet of a highway is always a bad idea. Likewise, it irks me to no end to see hunters hunting towards highways, even if they're 300 yards away, as many car/deer accidents in this area are the result of an irresponsible hunter spooking a deer into traffic. So yeah, responsible hunting I'm cool with, but I do think hunters need to stay away from traffic.

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
Kovu: Lions don't kill each other for fun.

Perhaps not, but animals do kill other animals for fun. Or are lions suddenly somehow superior?

Also, hunters=/=uncivilised.

[Nephilim]

Why part of me not talking about lions don't you understand? I'm talking about animals killing other animals, and not to eat them.

One could also say that a civilised person wouldn't eat meat knowing the way that animals are treated in farm factories.

[Ciara]

what animal are walking around to just kill other animals for fun anyway?

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by Ciara
what animal are walking around to just kill other animals for fun anyway?

Um, whales pick up seals, smash them to death against the ice, and then leave them there.

[Ciara]

um.. okey, rilly? :O

[Ciara]

i think whales are scared of seals and kill them in self defence .....

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
With whales/seals, what's to say the whale is doing it for 'fun'?

So a full grown whale, pulling a baby seal off of the shore and bashing it to death has some higher motive, something other than "for the Hell of it" behind it?

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
Also, I don't eat a lot of meat for that exact reason ^_^ ...

That's very uncivilised of you. I can't believe that a civilised person would even touch meat.

[Ciara]

are you a vegetarian Neph?

and for whales, ive never heard of any animal that kills others for nothing, cuz the nature just doesnt work so, animals takes that more srsly than we humans do ... Must be something behind it that we dont know yet or something ..

[Nephilim]

Ciara: have been for... six years now? Can't really remember.

STL: So by your logic, taking a gun and putting a bullet through an animal's head, and in many cases eating it, is just horrible, and yet taking animals, keeping them in in cages too small, pumping them with drugs, searing off their beaks and so on and so forth, for their entire lives is just fine?

[Ciara]

i see ... well that one is a vegetarian can keep this going on for ever then ... however theres no real answer, so it will prolly do so anyway ...

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
No, you're mixing up what I say. There's no need to hunt animals; for goodness sake you can just go down to Tesco and get some meat if you want some!

You're missing the point here! It's much kinder to animals to give them a sudden, unexpected death, then put them through all the Hell that farm factories do. Sheesh.

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
It would be kinder not to hunt them at all is my point; it's completely unnecessary!

Not entirely true (some people need meat to live), but it's the lesser of two evils.

[Pnt]

I don't understand the moral comparison that I keep seeing between humans and other animals. Every single animal that we know about on this planet at this time lacks the upper congnitive traits of humans. They do not face moral dilema of guilt, moral right and wrong, or past/future events with regards to moral stability; they just lack that structure of the brain, or a similar type of structure*. Animals do have emotions, but to the best of our knowledge, these emotions are neither complex nor involve moral cognition. They feel pain when they're hurt, they're sad when a family member die, they're happy when getting pet, etc... They do not, however, contemplate the origin of the Universe, feel guilt for eating their prey, or take comfort in the hopes of future events. Therefore, it wouldn't make much sense to compare a human to another animal when it comes to complex thought processes such as right and wrong, good and bad, etc..., as the animals lack the ability to make such a choice.


*Dolphins and a few primates may [i]possibly[i] be an exception, though no structure of their brain has been found that gives them the emotional complexity of humans.


That aside, I'd much rather a deer that lived in nature it's whole life and was very quickly killed by a hunter than a cow that lived in a confined area its entire life and was taken to mass slaughter.

[Nephilim]

Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
Who cares if most animals are not as intelligent as most humans (some animals are more intelligent than some humans which is amusing)? That doesn't make them any less important than us. You could make that same argument with a newborn baby who doesn't know any better.

Well, infanticide has been quite common throughout history, so I guess people have already beaten you to that. A new born baby has potential, whereas an animal does not.