changing to a new server?

[Sadiki]

As some might know there is talk on face book about getting our own server as we have way too many problems with the forum crashing time to time due things that are out of our hands.

So I thought of asking what do people think of this. it might be as cheap as 36 dollars a year, but the cost may increase if we want to do more with the site. Now I do not want anyone offering to pay the server on their own, a server of their pals or that they would be willing to pay for it... I solely wanna know how people feel about the subject. pros and cons... etc.

[KanuTGL]

If this means we are starting over one more time... Then, honestly, I'm out. I've had enough of putting my time into something that keeps disappearing again and again because we can't find a decent server host. The last time we changed hosts was for the same reasoning - we wanted things to be in our hands and not someone else's. Didn't work out this time either, did it?

This is ridiculous. It really is.

[/endvent] But, seriously, guys. There seems to be no end of absolutely rubbish servers/hosts that Lea ends up on; how are we gonna know that this suggested new one is gonna be any better?

[Utora]

If it means we have to start over but the server will STOP crashing, then I am in of course.

[King Simba]

I'm not really up for starting all over again, but if moving to a new server means that it'd be better in the long run, then I guess it'll just have to do.

[This Land]

Im not sure if i have a legitimate say in this because i hardly post on this forum. But it doesn't mean that i dont keep an eye on it. Every time you have mentioned a "better" server it hasn't been.

Why not use a forum service like proboards ?

-Their new V5 software that came out this year is brilliant, its got full customizability and can change it to how you want it to look and be used.

-Proboards also have Free customer support

-All server management is done by them, all you need to do is take care of is the forum itself and the members

-I have never had a single server problem with proboards in the whole 7 years i have used it!

-The service is completely Free

-Yes, there are ads but they can be taken off for $6 every 50,000 pageveiws. You can even set it so only members of the forum take up the pageveiws and not random guests/bots.

-You can transfer your own domain name (even one that you have already bought) to your proboards forum for a annual fee of $13.99 (thats $1.16 a month)

No brainer in my opinion.... :P

[ThiagoPE]

I have a fórum, which is running in phpbb (free software) since 2005 and i don´t remeber losing any post of it, and note we already were hacked, our servers already broke the HD several times... how whe achieved that? frequent backups.

Lea runs invision, which is a paid software (very expensive in my opinion) and for the Money that is spent on it, we should not had lose any post since lea started! The biggest problem of lea in my opinion is because there is no "backup team", actually there is no one even caring for problems of it (a "support" team).

There is no need to start over, as the fórum database can be restored, but there should be people specific for backup the site and people specific for fix its problems, because if not, we will keep losing its data, as always happened.

I think the price is paid for keeping lea is too high for the volume of acess it has, my braziian phpbb fórum, have more traffic than here, and are in a shared server whch i pay R$ 20 (10 US$) for month, no head aches with it until now, Lea runs in a dedicated server. so, if we increase the cost of keeping it, but not acting for this money have a cost/benefit, i don´t think the server should be changed, those erros we had last days i think it were just punctual problems.

Just my opinion.

[Kasei]

I don't know how much my two cents really counts since I'm so new, but I will still come back if there is a server move. I will go anywhere there are LK people to talk to!

I haven't had any errors since joining here, but, again, only just joined. From what I can tell though everything is working just fine and you head honchos are doing a fine job. :3


Also, this is probably a super fandom faux pas or something and I'm just not aware of it (and if it truly is, then feel free to ignore everything I'm about to say), but if there are so many problems with servers here for whatever reason and it comes down to moving but everyone is tired of starting over, why not just mutually agree to reconvene at another pre-existing forum like Lilymud or something? Or is there some kind of ancient rivalry between the two that I am not aware of? xD If so sorry to even suggest it. I only say Lilymud because, from what I've heard, the MLK forums are terrifying and that's the only other fandom forum I know about, hehe.

The only reason I suggest this as an alternative to moving (again, only if it comes to that) is because, at the end of the day, it's all TLK fandom. Why not gather together in the same place? And if one server is historically more reliable than another and already all set up, why not just slide on over? It'd be all the same Lea people anyway, plus whatever lurkers that still hang around over there...and who knows? Maye seeing posts every day on Lilymud will bring them out of hiding. xD Not to mention encourage new members to post if they see active topics. It has certainly encouraged me being with you all! I have never been so active on a forum in my life as I have been since coming here. xD

Maybe I'm saying something super offensive somehow, so sorry if the answer to this is an obvious "no" due to bad blood, loyalty to Lea, etc. it just makes sense to me to put everyone together if the decision to move is going to deter so many people from hanging around. Not to mention there is a link to Lilymud on the FAA main page so I feel Lilymud is a lot easier to find for new people.


Aaaanyway, before I get things hurled at me, I like Thia's idea of a support/backup crew if that is the main problem. If I knew the first thing about what that even meant I would volunteer to do it....but it sure sounds helpful! xD

[Dare]

Why not use a forum service like proboards ?

This. This this this, INFINITE THIS.

Going to Proboards (or something like it) is a suggestion that keeps coming up - perhaps it is time to try it?

I admit, I'm on my last leg with Lea. I don't want to leave/move, but I also don't want to stay on a forum that I feel could go *POOF* at any time.
Like Thiago said, we need a "backup team" or some kind of solid tech support that's going to be easily accessible if/when things to wrong.
At this time, I'm not inclined to think that this is something that members of our community are capable of doing - which is, once again, why I think using something like Proboards should be heavily considered.

[King Simba]

Yeah, I've used Proboards before, and I think it's a really good option. It's very easy to use and customize. I'd say it'd be worth giving it a try.

[HasiraKali]

I remember mentioning just moving from VBulletin to something else a few crashes ago. I think that's still the way to go.

[KanuTGL]

I haven't understood this clinging to vBulletin for years. It seems like an obsolete system and with the new Proboards software I'm pretty sure we could make Lea look exactly like Lea anyway.
Whether I'd join another reset is another question, like I said above. When it comes down to it I doubt I'd be able to really leave... but this time had better be the last time we lose everything.

[HasiraKali]

Agreed. I think if it goes down again, we might as well just migrate to the Facebook group and keep Lea alive that way.

[nathalie]

I am for the Proboards thing then.

I mean, is it really worth spending so much money on a new server then?
When Proboards is free, and I used to be on many of those, and can't remember any of them breaking down.
Also, anyone can contact them by mail, so we don't have to wait for someone who ran off like Lea 2, or like now, someone who's been unreachable for 5 months already :/

[Azerane]

Whether we shift servers, go to proboards or all bound on over to lilymud. Wherever Lea goes, there's probably a 110% chance I'll go too Though if I'm honest, I'm not really a fan of a facebook Lea. I much prefer a forum base than that.

[nathalie]

Yeah.
I just post stuff on FB Lea, because it seems that sometimes over 30-40 people do see the new posts.

While they don't "bother" to look over here anymore.
I think there's 10 of us left right now? If all the others who do look on FB would just come back then, we'd have a nicely running forum again, like we used to

Just my thought.

[HasiraKali]

I agree with you Nathalie. If they'd just come over once in a while.

[Sadiki]

Hmm this is a lot to absorb, thought it is clear that people do want to go on a new server for sure as this one is not really working out as well as thought. Also it seems that most people are for proboards, which runs of phpbb. As this seems to be majorities wish I wont be against the idea, but as I don't have time to learn how to use phpbb nor time to create lea from a scratch we will need someone else to create it. I'm more than happy to provide all the files I have as well as make the necessary changes to get the .org address on that board once it's ready. If that is the way people really want to go.

What comes to Lea's activity. Activity part shows we have 34 active members currently, meaning those people have logged on at least once in last 30 days. Even if FB numbers are greater than that, I personally refuse to make that primary Lea even if the majority of people decide to ditch the forum. Facebook is facebook, it's good for events and to notify if the board is down, but I personally really dislike facebook as a way discuss about anything, which was primary reason why I created the thread on the forum rather than keeping the discussion going on facebook.

Now I don't think I saw anybody being for staying with Vbulletin which I personally prefer due the fact that at least I can get around it and have easy time finding information how to do things on as we already bought the membership on it. Now I haven't really research how much it would cost to move it to another server as after creating this thread I saw how strongly people feel about the Vb. Now I would like to point out that none of our problems have ever been directly a fault of using Vb. First the database got corrupted due Mufasa updating his version of Vbulletin without backing up. Yes partly the problem was Vbulletin, but more carelessness. Second the forum went poof as we out sourced and had some random person running the forum. And now the server has been a bigger issue as well as the fact that I never been informed when there is going to be a change on the server. Thought I know I have been quite bad about creating back ups, but I was told the forum backsup itself every 2 weeks. Now what happened in september I have no idea, what I heard was that when Vbulletin was installed it chose the backup that was created during the hacking instead of the newest one and it was realized too long after server was already moved due the problem in server protocol.

As final words I want to say that no matter where the forum goes I follow. I also would like to ask out of curiosity if anyone here has still the Vbulletin database from the first board on their computer as I was reading something interesting a few days ago about corrupted databases and I would very much like to take look at it... I do know I have it on my old computer, but there is 7000 miles between us so I quite can't pull it out... I also found a way to combine databases on Vbulletin which means I should be able to connect this database to the database that was backed upped in June 2012 when ever if I ever have an access to this forum server to pull it out.

[Dare]

Now I don't think I saw anybody being for staying with Vbulletin which I personally prefer due the fact that at least I can get around it and have easy time finding information how to do things on as we already bought the membership on it. Now I haven't really research how much it would cost to move it to another server as after creating this thread I saw how strongly people feel about the Vb. Now I would like to point out that none of our problems have ever been directly a fault of using Vb. First the database got corrupted due Mufasa updating his version of Vbulletin without backing up. Yes partly the problem was Vbulletin, but more carelessness. Second the forum went poof as we out sourced and had some random person running the forum. And now the server has been a bigger issue as well as the fact that I never been informed when there is going to be a change on the server. Thought I know I have been quite bad about creating back ups, but I was told the forum backsup itself every 2 weeks. Now what happened in september I have no idea, what I heard was that when Vbulletin was installed it chose the backup that was created during the hacking instead of the newest one and it was realized too long after server was already moved due the problem in server protocol.

I can't speak for anyone else, but as for myself...I don't think vBulletin is the main issue, at least not software wise.
The problem is what it takes to have a reliable vBulletin forum running - the things behind the scenes, whether it's software updates, money, or a reliable maintenance crew.
You want to have a stable vBulletin board, you need to have the support for it - a reliable server (which will cost someone, somewhere, money...unless you want Lea to be a parasite), accessible tech support (someone who gets back to you within a couple of days, not a couple of months), updated software and patches, etc.

In short, I don't think the problem is the vBulletin software. The problem is maintaining the resources for vBulletin.
I hope that makes sense.

As for Proboards:
I'm not saying that Proboards is perfect - I've frequented several and even ran one for 8 years and there have been some issues, but in those 8 years I can't recall anything that would even come close to what Lea's been through. The best part about it was that I didn't have to worry about maintaining databases, I didn't have to worry about servers, I didn't have to worry about keeping my forum software updated, - Proboards took care of all of that, and if something glitched, a support team was a mere email/forum post away.

But now I feel as though I've talked about Proboards ad nauseum. In the end, I don't really care where Lea ends up, as long as it's somewhere stable...which, considering Lea's history, is probably a pipe dream. Seriously guys, I think this forum is cursed. Maybe we should sacrifice a virgin or something?

[This Land]

I have a day off tomorrow =3

Im currently going to be doing work to my own forum, so i can have a go at making a Lea aswell if you want, im easy =3.

[Azerane]

I think that's a very good offer of you TL, would be great to see how it turns out for you, if you need any help, just let me know as I'd be happy to, though I wouldn't be comfortable setting it up on my own, happy to help though.

I think it's worth creating Lea on proboards and developing it over there, I'm not sure how the site address works, but if possible we could always have both forums opens for a period of time as a transition period, especially for people that don't regularly visit. Unless of course we can keep the address (though I'm not sure if that works with proboards)

Dare makes a very valid point, as it's not so much about the software, but the people backing it up, we just don't have the constant man-power that proboards would have. I'm not saying people have done a bad job, it's just that volunteers aren't always going to be around when you need them and doing every constant update.