Quote:
Originally posted by pntbll248
As for the main point of the thread:
1. I started seeing mentions of closing the thread. Now, I don't think it's gonna get closed anytime soon, but before it becomes even more popular of an opinion, I figured I'd say that this is why we never get things fixed. Every time someone makes an effort to improve the forum, people start arguing until it escalates to the point where the thread needs closed. Then the members all hold grudges, the problem isn't mentioned again for a long while, and when it is mentioned, it's worse than it was before. This thread needs to remain open for the good of the forum as a whole (and really, I also think it should be a pawprint so that a member can voice a concern with one or more of the moderating staff).
2. I don't think we need to be arguing, I think we need to be fixing any problems.
One of the solutions I think would help is a moderator log thread that shows major things that a moderator or administrator does (If you're a moderator and you take some kind of major action, you would post in that thread). I think that'll not only help show the members what's going on, but it'll help the staff as well. That way, if someone says a staff member doesn't do their job, that staff member can point right to that thread, say "I did this, this, and this, I do my job" and they wouldn't have to worry about false accusations. It'll help the forum as a whole, because if that staff member really isn't doing their job, hasn't been active, or reacted in a way that's not appropriate, then that'll also be evident in the thread.
Another solution that we should consider is the fact that the members are able to care for themselves. I've noticed that sometimes certain staff members are very sensitive to tensions or maybe just looking for a thread to close. In threads where people get into it a bit, like debates, religious threads, and so on, I think that usually things should be allowed to get a bit more heated before any action is taken. It's much better to let the members involved work it out themselves instead of just closing down the thread and ending the argument there. Likewise, I think the general members of the forum need to show responsibility and respectability and try to follow the rules so that the mods don't have to get involved in the first place. I tend to think that less rules, or more lenient enforcement, does quite a bit for the moral of the forum, but also demands more responsibility from everyone. That also means to some members really need to grow up a bit, not be offended by everything, and not be calling for every thread where they didn't get their way to be closed. That doesn't mean that it's wrong to be offended when you actually are offended, it means that we need to learn to choose our battles and let the unimportant stuff slide. Of course, if the thread gets to the point where it's just a yelling match, then actions need to be taken.
I have noticed quite a few times where certain staff members have basically said "If you don't like it, go away" (I think wicked mentioned that as well). Well, just as a heads up, that does absolutely nothing to help. It's a great cop-out to get your way, and on occasions may be appropriate, but I'd very much like to hear less "If you don't like it, then leave" and much more "What would you suggest we do?". But, also along those lines, I think that if someone has a problem with something, instead of just complaining, they should also explicity say what they would like done about it. Just saying "That was a very bad thing to have done" is not going to do much (so don't expect it to), but saying "That was a bad idea, I think it would have been much better if you would have done this".
Finally, I think that we need to go about discussing things mentioned in this thread maturely. There's no reason for the staff to get upset if someone has a problem with their performance, especially not after the staff asked the forum their opinion. Likewise, the members need to go about discussing their problems maturely with the staff.
As for members leaving because of the staff, I do think that that's well within possible. Doesn't mean the staff as a whole should be attacked for that, I see 90% of the staff doing a good job, but I also think that it's a legitimate statement that it is possible that a member has or may leave based in part or in full upon the actions of certain staff members. If a member may leave because of a normal member, then they can just as easily leave because of a staff member.
Well said, Pnt. Some interesting ideas there. I really think a mod log could possibly work for the more public things. However, there is still some stuff that we couldn't morally put into even that. Say that I hypothetically had to PM (enter name here) a warning for misbehaving. That would be between me and that person. Unless someone was offended, or a more drastic messure was nessecary, I don't think it would be right to make that warning public. However, there have been a few minor things that I have done that not even admins no about to this day that could have been added. Such as sticking the New Years and Christmas posts, editing out the no longer existant forums from the list in the "Welcome to Lea" post in Pride Rock, and adding the add on about cussing in Fuzzy's rule post in this forum. 