Seeing as there seems to be no admins...

I spent many years to admin similar comunity site, and got a lot of experince with similar events. All of them was solved in peace and to suited both.

People cannot judge by first look. Yes, this looks like harrasment but it's maybe not so bad as it looks. If you say he's guilty without any close look, it's like in middle age. This really have to be solve privately and if admins are not accessible, you can ask moderators to help somehow. She have to prove that he did harrassment and he can apologize.

However, that's is REALLY NOT OUR BUSINESS to judge. In my eyes, this is vulgar, stupid and moral-less and everyone who judge without prove may blush. And really no matter if admins can react or not. Again, it's not our business.

And about remove services. This is mostly easiest way, but if it's right solution it's very discutabble. If I'm admin I would update PM to make it more useabble. For example they include some optional "word filter" to prove such messages. Again, IMHO, removing services is no really inteligent solution, but easiest.

People always have the option of disabling their own individual PMs so that no one can PM you...and they also have the option of Ignoring people.
It wouldn't be fair to remove the PM feature...at least not from all of us. Why punish everyone for the crime of one?
I'm not sure if there's a way to individually go in and remove one person's PM privs though...I'm not familiar with the admin functions of vBulletin.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Lweek

However, that's is REALLY NOT OUR BUSINESS to judge. In my eyes, this is vulgar, stupid and moral-less and everyone who judge without prove may blush. And really no matter if admins can react or not. Again, it's not our business.

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How is it not our business? Neph came to us, in her own way, with a sexual harrassment problem. Neph found a way to solve the problem by making sure something (the posts, not the person) creepy and perverted was known to the entire forum. Now that we know, it's the jobs of the mods and the members themselves to decide what kind of forum we want. Do we want a forum that is harrassing? Do we want a forum that welcome sexually oriented material? Is this the kind of actions we want on a forum with friggin' kids? This isn't a matter of an annoyance or a personal squabble, it's worse.

I'm bad at explaining what I mean sometimes, so I'll use an example. If someone comes up to you and tells you that someone they hardly know felt them up after they repeatedly told them to go away, would you tell them that it's not your business? Would you say the same thing to the people of the community if there was a court hearing? Would you tell the courts themselves that it wasn't their business? What if that someone that was abused was in your family? I consider neph part of a broad extended family (internet family :p), and I look out for family. Thus, it's my business.

well Lweek hes got ya there pretty much i think dude.
Well said Pnt that was explained quite well ;) kudos to ya.
I don't want a forum like that..smutty

Pnt explained it perfectly. I must say that Lea has become a very sad place if our mindset is 'It's none of our business'. Sexual Harassment is a CRIME!

Frankly I think Lea is WAY too sensitive of other people's feelings. Sometimes that can be a good thing, but for a while now it has really been a nuisance. And when it gets to the point that people are worried more about the suspect(Phantom) than the victim(Neph).. I must say I'm very sickened! It disturbs me, it seriously does.

Get a backbone, that's my message to this forum. It's a great quality to care about others, but not to this point. Seriously. Pnt made a great point a while back about this actually. That he had to write 'I didn't mean any offense to anyone on a personal level' or something to that effect after each of his posts.

We shouldn't have to do that. All things in moderation, even kindness, as this thread has proven <<

Edit: *edited for spelling errors*

While it's agreeable that it's everybody's business, I don't see why we're arguing about whose business it is and why we're not arguing about what to do about all this. Then again, the only problem with that is that Lea is technically in a state of anarchy.

Perhaps we should create a peoples' government in Mufasa & Sarabi's absence and lay down our own laws or something.

It is generally agreed that sexual harassment is a crime. Crime merits punishment.

Perhaps the mods should get together and discuss this. I would suggest a punishment system based upon the severity of a crime. I've only tested vBulletin before and I don't know exactly what powers Mufasa has given the mods, but surely they can do something.


If things start to get really bad, it might be possible to contact the admins. Now I don't know if any of this information is up to date, but a WHOIS lookup of leahalalela.com gives addresses & a couple phone numbers. Out of privacy and respect, I'm not going to post any info here, but if anybody's interested they could try to contact Mufasa and/or Sarabi.

http://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/whois.asp

Just type in leahalalela and then on the next page type in the antispam confirmation.

Hey cool... I wonder if Mufasa still lives in Langley, I live like 20 minutes from him..:P

Quote:

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Originally posted by Ravoc
Pnt explained it perfectly. I must say that Lea has become a very sad place if our mindset is 'It's none of our business'. Sexual Harassment is a CRIME!

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Yes. like Pnt and Ravoc says: Sexual Harrasment is a CRIME...:cheese:

Amused much.

No, not really any of my concern since I don't come here so often anymore. [SIZE=small]Online Drama!!111!![/SIZE]

yes.. and Free Pop Corn :D

Quote:

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Originally posted by Guntur
yes.. and Free Pop Corn :D

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Dude. Not cool. </spam>

yeh sorry Zack dude you Spam way to much dude...and its not a very good idea spaming in this thred since well its got nowt to do with the situation....and its not funny.
Srry bro but Ruska is right. Not kool bro...not kool.

Quote:

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Originally posted by pntbll248
There has to be a compromise between the two groups; I don't like the randomness on the forum, some other member genuinely think it's fun. Because there's no admins for the forum right now, howabout the members who love randomness just all get together and make their own forum. If anyone needs help with Invision Powerboards (setting them up), I'd be happy to help set one up for you. Then you can be as random as you want on that forum and the members of lea who don't like spam are happy too, as long as you keep it off here. Or, the members who don't like spam could make/move to another forum and have all the great conversations we want to have without the annoyance of "OMG!!11Qq I'M A TOENAIL!!1!.!>" every post.

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Well most of my randomness is actually spur of the moment stuff, so I wouldn't go on a forum just to spam. There are however (as I mentioned earlier) TWO threads that are made for the exact purpose of spam and randomness. I don't know why people don't use them. I thought Utora's thread that had no topic should be used for spammers and people who have bouts of randomness.

i'll be honest, my forum is a place for randomness.

see my profile if you want the address

EDIT: I just thought i'd say i'm not taking this as a place to advertise, but i just think that the randomness should be kept for appropiate places.

Quote:

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Originally posted by IchLiebeNALA
i'll be honest, my forum is a place for randomness.

see my profile if you want the address

EDIT: I just thought i'd say i'm not taking this as a place to advertise, but i just think that the randomness should be kept for appropiate places.

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Yes, I was just about to suggest that Dan.:D
I agree that Dan's forum is a good place for a random convosation with people about things unrelated to TLK. What do you expect from a place called "Anything Goes" forum?;)

and if you do decide to register, vote for Lucy in the Admin Polls ;)

(that be Lucy Lioness, but she isnt registered as that on the forum)

You know what? You guys don't even know if Phantom's joking or not, and Neph was COMPLETELY wrong in posting this thread. God, that sickens me. How do you know he's a pervert and not just joking around?

Let me explain. Phantom MAY have Asperger's Syndrome, a condition under the umbrella of autism. This disorder (I'm about 90% sure I have it) isn't as bad as autism, but they often have a different sense of humor or way of dealing with things than others.

Take me for example. I tend to take death very lightly. If it's someone I know, I'll be polite and not make jokes or if it was a tragic accident (like that one Mission Space kid), but if it's something that's too freaking ironic (like the guy in the Pluto costume) I'm gonna laugh my butt off.

I don't know if that's the way Phantom is (only substitute 'sexual harrassment' with 'death'), but I pretty much guarantee he was joking.

I found nothing wrong with the PM, which iether means I'm a huge frigging idiot, or you all are overreacting.

It really doesn't matter about whether this was a joke, and whether 'Phantom' himself thought it was serious or not. The point is, sexual harrassment is not acceptable anywhere, and especially not acceptable on a TLK board. 'Phantom' could claim to have Asperger's syndrome all he likes, but this is the internet, and for all i know that could be a lie.

If suddenly it was ok for people to break the rules, as long as they say they only do it because they have Asperger's, then how would Lea end up? :confused:

Besides, i know of a few other members who also claim to have Asperger's (and i have no reason to doubt them), including you ChildOfThePride, but nobody has ever behaved like 'Phantom' has. If they can control themselves, then there's no reason why 'Phantom' can't either.

Btw, if it was unclear before, i think Nephilim's decision to make this public was a great decision. There was no other way to deal with this situation, since there are no admins available. And now we all know what 'Phantom' is truly like, and can decide whether we really want to know a person like him.

This thread has existed for a while, and so far he hasn't tried to sincerely apologise to anyone, so i think it's clear what kind of person he is.

well, maybe he saw it as a joke, and doesnt feel the need to apologise

EDIT: I think it was:

Quote:

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Originally posted by PhantomBPR
Hey Neph, if you didn't like it why didn't you say something, it was a joke I meant nothing against you if you took it that way, jeez I thought you were someone I could joke with.

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As it was a self-diagnosis, I'm not entirely sure on how AS affects other people. Had I been DX'd by a doctor, I would have probably asked if it affected other people different ways.

Child of the pride, I dont think you are a friggin idiot.

If Neph was upset by this which she clearly states, I agree with her making this thread since there isnt much else she can do.

Let say I would PM someone and keep going joke or not until he/she was upset about it.

Sure he/she can put me on ignore but that wouldn't not change the fact that I would still be around even if that person doesnt see me.

Now when Neph made this thread, she made it so we could see what had happened so we would know about it.

So we could judge Phantom and see what he had to say.

Lets say this was a class and it was real persons and someone was being harrassed wouldnt you want to know about it so you could see if it was just a joke (a strange one at that) or that we have someone among us who harasses people. I for one would like to know that.

I usually only make sence to myself but hey if you understood what I meant good for you.

I gotcha.

Maybe I overreacted a bit, I tend to do that sometimes. I guess I just get mad when I think people are jumping down someone's throat.

And that frigging idiot thing was just an exaggeration. :cool:

hehe, of course it was COTP *pets COTP* jk :p

@ IchLiebeNALA: we do know now you also have a forum ;) Don't need to advertise it so many times.

(I don't wanna sound rude or anything)

hehe, it's fine Nathalie. you didnt sound rude

Sorry for my reactions, but I'm gettig sick of this thread. This is not good for anyone even Neph or Phantom. Harasment is a crime, but we have't be sure it's reall harassment and we don't know how much is Neph injured. Actualy she's seems to be like a person who doesn't care much about how feel others, but I don't know. I will not judge her, I don't know her. And that's the point. Anyway, Phantom say his sorry and it's most important. We don't know nothing about what really happened and that's why we cannot judge. That what Phantom wrote in PM was bad joke, you all are right but this kind of topic can force him to make suicide or something if he's mentaly weak somehow. Is it really what you like? Is it?? Oh men, let's go stop to play about liberty, nor George Bush who allow throw bombs to civilians in name of blind liberty. Jeezz!

Quote:

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Originally posted by ChildOfThePride
You know what? You guys don't even know if Phantom's joking or not, and Neph was COMPLETELY wrong in posting this thread. God, that sickens me. How do you know he's a pervert and not just joking around?

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I find this kinda funny. By your logic, it's okay for me to go down to the street and rape a child. It's okay, I'm not pervereted; I'm just joking around. Somehow I think not. ^^

For example, you're friends with Suki. Afasik, she's had problems with people being mean to her IRL. I'm sure they do/did it as a joke and to be funny, but does that really make it okay?

Quote:

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Originally posted by ChildOfThePride
Let me explain. Phantom MAY have Asperger's Syndrome, a condition under the umbrella of autism. This disorder (I'm about 90% sure I have it) isn't as bad as autism, but they often have a different sense of humor or way of dealing with things than others

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Whether or not he has that disorder, that's still not a good excuse for his behaviour.

Quote:

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LWeek.

Actualy she's seems to be like a person who doesn't care much about how feel others, but I don't know.

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Now that is a really horrible thing to say...

I agree with a few posters that perhaps this wasn't the appropriate first step for Nephilim to make in dealing with this problem. I have no idea if she contacted any of the moderators before posting this thread; I would always recommend that prior to posting a private matter publicly.

However, given that our attempts to get PhantomBPR to use more discretion on this forum have been only partially successful, I would have supported her posting this thread as a last resort.

Now that the thread is here, though, let's stick to the facts. Nephilim received some PM's which she felt to be inappropriate. It's obvious that she's mad about it. I don't understand how people can call her insensitive and mean it. It's her very sensitivity that led her to create this thread in the first place. I'm sure she doesn't want this happening to anyone else, so she chose to take the most direct route. Maybe she could have chosen a more private route first, but what's done is done. Let's focus on the intent of her message, not the words.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Lweek
Oh men, let's go stop to play about liberty, nor George Bush who allow throw bombs to civilians in name of blind liberty. Jeezz!

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I'm not even sure what you're trying to say here, but it has no place in the current conversation and strikes me as insensitive considering it's the day after the US' Independance Day (4th July).

Quote:

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Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
Optional word filters are hard to implement, and even then, people could go around the filters easily.

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Not only that, but word filters only stop the word being shown, they don't take the word out completely. So the reader still knows what they intended to say.

If we wanted to impliment any disciplinary action for inappropriate PM's, I think disallowing the individual offending member from using the PM service would be adequate, after a certain amount of times being reported.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Nephilim
I find this kinda funny. By your logic, it's okay for me to go down to the street and rape a child. It's okay, I'm not pervereted; I'm just joking around. Somehow I think not. ^^

For example, you're friends with Suki. Afasik, she's had problems with people being mean to her IRL. I'm sure they do/did it as a joke and to be funny, but does that really make it okay?



Whether or not he has that disorder, that's still not a good excuse for his behaviour.



Now that is a really horrible thing to say...

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Okay, maybe I didn't get the point across half as well. I tend to be a bit unclear sometimes.

As long as they don't act on it, it's fine with me.

And in the case of Suki, well, that's not exactly the topic posted in the thread, so I won't discuss it.

Quote:

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Originally posted by SimbaTheLion
It may not be 'intelligent' to remove it, but if people can't use it responsibly, do they deserve to have the privilege?

Optional word filters are hard to implement, and even then, people could go around the filters easily.

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Nope. It isn't so hard. At least for me. :) Word filter can do more .. it can deny send message if it include more than one or two of bad words .. it can event test sample sestences etc. Even, you can implement ignore list which is the best solution IMHO.

One of programmer motto says that "enemy of programmer is user". But there are many good ways how to force users use serveices responsible. Validators and access rules .. that's are most powerfull tools for programmers. :)

Quote:

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Originally posted by Lweek
Oh men, let's go stop to play about liberty, nor George Bush who allow throw bombs to civilians in name of blind liberty. Jeezz!

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I agree with Woes that your comment was quite offensive and has no place in the current topic at all. Back off of America bub ;)

i personally think that this thread is getting totally out of hand now. it has totally diverted off the original topic and has turned into a slanging match against america (no offence Lweek)

Quote:

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Originally posted by Nephilim
Now that is a really horrible thing to say... [/B]

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That's my judge .. on first look. Is it sound horrible? Now you know how Phantom could feel.

To all:
I'm going to leave this topic because I feel I'm going be too much engaged and I wont. Sorry for I wrote. Enjoy 4th, Independance day and please don't vote Bush again. :)

EDIT: typos

yeah but unlike you Neph wasn't saying from a first view she had experience on him.

Have you ever spoken to Neph then maybe you will actually know she does care.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Lweek
I will not judge her, I don't know her. And that's the point.

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He also said this, after that other thing he said.

I'm personally VERY tired of this thread.
Obviously we all think in our ways and are not coming anywhere with this. What's the use of lettin' this get off topic as everything else? (ooh sorry.. really)
The best way to solve this problem would be for Phantom to realise that he's made a big mistake and tell Neph he's done wrong and make an apology. (If he don't already have). I mean it's a big mistake too harass someone. Then I hope Phantom can stop with these sexual crimes. It's REALLY not funny.
And some kind of disorder is NO excuse to harass someone.
This is a big mistake of Phantom. I think you should try to realise what you have done and STOP doing it. It's NOT funny.

ah god I'm getting fed up of this thred so I'm gonna stay out of it from now on