Truth behind 9-11? Was it the Government?

[Kovu The Lion]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2023320890224991194

Watch this, And then post. Don't say anything until you watch at least enough so you know what you are talking about.


From what I've seen from here. I am literally freaking out right now. So much is described and proven wrong and things and it all seems.. Perfect.

The quotes and facts for the Pentagon, about it having a whole of 16 meters Diameter. Thats not big enough for an airplane. They suggest it be a cruise missile.

IS the US Government actually the people behind the 9-11 Attacks? What do you think?

~KTL~

[Hanshilo]

Soz i am gonna edit all that, yeah i do think that the US goverment did it, there is no way that osama bin laden would have been able to pull it off, and that video is proff of it, so why would the FBI hide something, and the answers are going to be lurking in area 51 of course, Though I am gobsmacked about this, and i always blamed the asians and muslims for it, now i really have a right to call Goerge a *bleep*er for he has caused so much hate in the world, sent innocent americans out to war aswell, but now it adds up doesn't it...
a peice of txt from my mouth:-
"Goerge bush resented, muslims, afganistans, basically he is a rasist person ok i mean i here jokes all the time, and i don't like rasiscm, i mean i critizies the way our schoolo works and how asians get away with a lot more than we do but, back on topic, Goerge needed a good reson to go off to bomb afganistan, and kill bin laden and de-power saddam... as i name goerge bush "oilman" and oh yeah the video clip the so called "Confession tape" When it had just appeared saying that they made a device to mimic an exact replica of that person, giving goerge bush a sly idea to accuse these people of doing it, as by then creating a copy cat of bin laden, and using this device to mimic... the plane that hit the towers, now this is going to be funny, cause when the it was shown on TV, i knew straight away that something was not right, with the attack and i did notice the explosions whilst they came down, but who planted the bombs? and why? that movie is worth the wait people so watch then you will see what a complet *Beep* Ur goverment is..."

This has most probably not made any sense but i understand, and i don't like it one bit, the US goverment are most probably the ones after world domination not the al qeada"and when you watch the video, you will all understand why i can't stand Goerge bush or the goverment

[Juniper]

You guys are absolutely sick, I have no respect for you.


However, things like the flash before the plane hits are easily explained and have already been explained. In front of a piece of metal traveling that fast there is an extremely high pressure layer of air, as no plane is perfectly aerodynamic. The layer of air collided with the force that would have made it like concrete. Simple physics. Jet engines disintegrate into tiny pieces on contact with the ground at 550 mph in a dive. Likewise, the plane dove into the Pentagon, applying more force towards the ground; the images claiming there wasn't a skid mark were taken from the wrong side of the building. For instance, the whole thing with the plane and how it wouldn't go through that large of a building and leave a hole on the other side; that's assuming that the plane itself caused the whole; planes hitting building cause a lot of energy to be released. The World Trade Centers collapsed due to the addition of jet fuel, which would easily soften them to the point of collapse (it does not have to melt); there would be enough jet fuel remaining in the building to burn. This person completely falsified these claims, saying that it would not soften, melt or whatever, which is a contradiction to fact, especially with the actual impact of a boeing jetliner. There would be explosions from pockets of air and flammable substances in the building heating up (that was the most pathetic piece of "Evidence" of the whole thing). The collapse of the WTCs have been verified as what would happen by twenty-seven firemarshals.

This video makes elementary mistakes in physics, and is somewhat inconsistent with itself, and disregards human error. Eyewitness accounts are almost always going to vary due to the fact that they involve people who are in a lot of stress, didn't see the whole thing, and have finite memories. He makes claims that assume the entire buildings would need to collapse at once, while only two or three levels needed to. Which is more logical to believe, the US was attacked by another group of individuals, or the US attacked itself, convinced all the people involved to stay quite (there's going to be hundreds or thousands of people involved to pull off this one), lied to the media on the grandest scale in the history of man, and staged the entire thing in pure view of the public? Then I assume the government got eighteen super-corporations, including Boeing, in on it, made three planes disappear, shuffled out all the debris that's evidence before people could see it, silenced all those people invovled too? So, not a single person in the government has come out, out of thousands of people, and said "I helped the government attack the WTCs and the Pentagon"? The government couldn't pull off Watergate.

Learn some physics, learn some logic, and learn some respect. I am not remaining on a forum that is such a disgrace.

-Pntbll.

[Endra]

I agree with Pnt, 9/11 was not done by our government.

To add to Pnt's description of why the WTC collapsed...

The World Trade Center towers were built in a unique way, called a "perimeter tube" design. This means that instead of the steel beams divided evenly throughout the building, they are concentrated in the centre, to allow for more floorspace (if you remember, that was one of the major selling points for offices in the WTC, large, open floorspace). Unfortunately, this design has an enormous flaw, which was exploited.

Now, to coincide with Pnt's description, just use your common sense. A large plane with a full tank of jet fuel hits the building. No matter where the plane hits, the building would eventually collapse due to the design. Since all of the support for the building is in the centre, the plane would completely take out the support (and all of the escape routes for people above the wreck). The sheer amount of energy released by the explosion would blow off any fireproofing on the steel beams above the crash. All it would take is time for the floors above the crash to weaken, and eventually collapse. After one floor collapses, it is a domino effect. With one floor gone, the building cannot handle the strain of holding the top floors, so the entire building collapses, floor by floor, leaving very little standing.

There were no bombs in the WTC. 2 Boeing 767 commercial jets filled to the brim with fuel has more than enough firepower to take out these particular buildings.

Kali.... OUT. (Gah I hate you Ryan Seacrest!)

[unregistered user]

I'm too annoyed and angry about this to post anything right now... just, shame on you =/

[Katse]

My justification for this: why the heck would the government attack their own building that contributes enormously to our economy and their pay checks?

Besides, that film quality is horridly low and, for all we know, those "missiles" shot could've easily been photoshopped into there.

Of course, my computer only let me watch a couple of minutes of the video.>_>;

[Juniper]

Someone over MSN brought up the point that if I were to leave at this point in time, I'd be looking the other way to ignorance, that it's not me, and I would have to agree. This forum has been ruined for me because the basal level of hope I had in every member of this forum was destroyed. Maybe I overreacted by saying I'm leaving, maybe I didn't, but I will stay for now, past this thread, I don't know, this was just too far.

All I have left to say on the topic is what I have already said, that this is sick, and that the people who buy into this crap should be ashamed of themselves for disgracing the people and their families affected by 9/11. When I was a kid, I was told that some things are sacred, some things are not to be defiled in such a way; I guess that concept has left society as whole (Though I cannot judge society based on the actions of a few).

My final argument for the matter is for logic. It is illogical to say that the government did this, and then covered it up. There would be too many people involved, it is impossible to cover up such a distaster in such a way. It is illogical to think that the media lied about the whole thing, that all the documentaries on the Discovery Channel, History Channel, CNN, etc... lied about the whole thing; or, more importantly, wouldn't have found out given all their investigations. It is illogical to think the the tens of thousands of official documents on the subject were wrong, it is illogical that the democratic party, who are opposed to the Republican part and would have jumped at this chance, would have kept quiet. It is illogical that Al Quaeda would have lied about their involvement, it is illogical that the people of the United States and the World would have been so easily tricked. It is illogical that government would have done this for any means, as the nation was devastated, both economically and physically, and has not led to any measurable good resulting from this tragedy.

What is logical is that the United States were attacked on September 11, 2001 by a terrorist organization that has attacked that very same building in the past, admitted to bombing it, and has been opposed to western society for decades.

[Hanshilo]

But why would anyone want lie about it, it doesn't make sense how there was nothing to prove a plane had crashed, and then the pentagon had been hit by something too, apparentl a boieng 57 i thinkl it was, and yet it was just a hole, nothing compared to the twin towers where I swear that was not a normal plane, that was definatly a fighter jet... i mean what was in the box covered in blue sheets, where was the debrie of the plane that hit the pentagon, why would bin laden want to hit the towers, I don't believe someone like that would want to hurt innocent ppl, but then again, wouldn't stop goerge, i mean as it said on the video, it was planned to much lika a demolition, But i know alot of ppl that think that none on lea, that i know of...

I mean no need to get all offended by this, it is only goerge, plus anyways what happened to "freedom of speech"... can't say anything anymore... without getting a mouthfall:confused:

[Katse]

It is suspected that terrorists like Osama Bin Laden attacked the Twin Towers because that is a major building in our economic society. As the name suggests, it's the World Trade Center, as in our economic communication with other countries is done in that building. Attacking and destroying that wouldn't only scare the living daylights out of our citizens, but cause a lot of damage to our economy. The whole point of the attack was to make us go into another depression, like in the 30's.

Oh, and terrorists attack people. Sure, they may take into the consideration that they'll be killing off innocents that had nothing to do with their hatred, but it would be a "small price" to pay in order to get what they want.

[Juniper]

Originally posted by Hanshilo
But why would anyone want lie about it, it doesn't make sense how there was nothing to prove a plane had crashed, and then the pentagon had been hit by something too, apparentl a boieng 57 i thinkl it was, and yet it was just a hole, nothing compared to the twin towers where I swear that was not a normal plane, that was definatly a fighter jet... i mean what was in the box covered in blue sheets, where was the debrie of the plane that hit the pentagon, why would bin laden want to hit the towers, I don't believe someone like that would want to hurt innocent ppl, but then again, wouldn't stop goerge, i mean as it said on the video, it was planned to much lika a demolition, But i know alot of ppl that think that none on lea, that i know of...

I mean no need to get all offended by this, it is only goerge, plus anyways what happened to "freedom of speech"... can't say anything anymore... without getting a mouthfall:confused:

Why would Bin Laden, a man who has led attacks against thirty-nine coutries and killed countless people attack the US, the only remaining Super Power on the face of the Earth whose culture he is deeply opposed to? Are you serious? I don't know if you're aware, but the World Trade Centers have been bombed before, in 1994 I believe, by a terrorist organization relating back to Al-Quaeda. So, now there's two instances where the government has lied to us, doubling the amount of people involved.

What hit the world trade center were two boeing jetliners; there's no convinceable evidence to prove otherwise. It could not have been a fighter jet, would you please wake up from your little dream world?

That box could very well have been the charred remains of the people killed in the crash, debris being protected from the misty atmosphere, or anything else. Are you seriously going to let your ignorant, uninformed opinions about the US blind you to this situation which only happened a few year ago? Is this how you are going to represent your country to the nationalities of this board?

[Hanshilo]

Yeah but Goerge bush needed good resons for war he is like his dad, war hungry, if goerge could make it look like that he would he has power to scilence ppl. to stop things getting out, maybe it is time he quit his day job and you got a decnet president, in, a female president maybe they are much better at running countries

[Juniper]

Okay, so what you have told us so far is that you disregard logic, heaps of legitimate evidence, and think that the US government is out to get the good people of the world, including it's own citizens, simply so the President can have power. You've said the the entire thing is a cover-up, most definately thousands of times larger than any in human history, and was able to be pulled off without any major flaw; and more importantly, that you and the very few other people that believe this are somehow seeing something that the rest of the world has failed to recognize. That a terrorist leader is not responsible for the terrorist attacks, but the President of the United States of America. That's called insanity where I come from.

It's sad that you are so misinformed of our country, and are acting like such a bigot therein, that you would go along with this so blindly.

[unregistered user]

Pnt - 1993 ;). Yes I think Al-Qaeda is related to 1993 bomb and I think Al Qaeda responsible for the 9/11. Al Qaeda is a Terrorist organization not a muslim organization.

[Hanshilo]

I am only on about Goerge in this...
Why would he i don't know he is a plonker and an idiot, looks it too actually. he is just another guy in my opinion...
And i always thought he and blair had something going between them, all these ppl are the same, but goerge is really quite simple:-
1.Greedy
2.Sly
3.Would do anything for a war
4.he would lie to his own ppl to save himself
5.and finally he shall suffer, and i hope he doesn't survive and somebody sorts this mess out before goerge goes to far...

as far as i am concerned, all these leaders are the same, and are nothing but greedy plonkers who need sorting, out...

Dunno who inveted this so called "FREEDOM OF SPEECH" So i am taking the opertunity to say wat i like, i doin't care what ppl think i am just saying what i think, and yes i do belive what i see, cause it doesn't look edited and it seems more logical... But wait a minute, the al queada hmmmm pretty much of the ppl that were fought to of been involved are living happily doing their own thing... and they were meant to of been in that attack, then why where they not on record, then it was on about a passport made of paper coming out untouched, imposible

[Juniper]

Originally posted by Hanshilo
I am only on about Goerge in this...
Why would he i don't know he is a plonker and an idiot, looks it too actually. he is just another guy in my opinion...
And i always thought he and blair had something going between them, all these ppl are the same, but goerge is really quite simple:-
1.Greedy
2.Sly
3.Would do anything for a war
4.he would lie to his own ppl to save himself
5.and finally he shall suffer, and i hope he doesn't survive and somebody sorts this mess out before goerge goes to far...

And now you've resorted to circular reasoning; George Bush is bad because he is is an Idiot, Greedy, Sly, Warmongering, a Liar, and that he should be killed. Seems like you aren't using any factual evidence, but instead want the United States to be responsible for the attacks. Regardless of whether you hate Bush, he could not have done it alone, there would be thousands upon thousands of people involved to some extent. Are you saying that these people are just as Idiotic, Greedy, Sly, War-hungry, lying, and should also be killed? Now, that sounds a bit far-fetched, don't you think?

[Katse]

As much as I'm not into politics, Hanshilo, your post makes me laugh at your ignorance. Who are you to assume what goes on in the head of our President or for anyone else, for that matter?

As pnt said, we've had continuous problems with the Middle East. Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda attacked because they dislike the material influence some of our people have put onto theres. We were attacked by them and, according to my knowledge, a President is supposed to take action against the attackers that threatened his country.

[Hanshilo]

No i didn't say killed, i mean get rid of him kick him out before there is no america left, cause he causes most of your problems...

[Juniper]

No, he causes most of your problems; you being an individual. I do not like George Bush, but I do not think he is to blame for all our problems or the world's problems. He is your scapegoat for what you see wrong in society.

You said he should suffer and that you hope he doesn't survive, that would therefore mean that you think he should die in some form.

[Hanshilo]

"a President is supposed to take action against the attackers that threatened his country." needs to shoot himself then lol...

So why would the FBI take off with tapes that show that there was nho sightings of a plane hitting the pentagon, i seriosly think somethings up with that...

[Hanshilo]

maybe he should have been in the pentagon when the missile hit i don't know he was most probaly sat on his lazy arse laughing...:gasp: wouldn't surprise me, then uhm well i am not looking at socioty just america, maybe you need to take a good look at him and thinks whats he done for us... Apart from pain and misery...

[Katse]

Originally posted by Hanshilo
"a President is supposed to take action against the attackers that threatened his country." needs to shoot himself then lol...

So why would the FBI take off with tapes that show that there was nho sightings of a plane hitting the pentagon, i seriosly think somethings up with that...

No, you still don't understand. I'm not much of an "OMGIWUVBUSHYAY" person, myself, but I feel it as my duty, as well as other Americans, to show our patriotism and defend our country. Now, you think he should shoot himself if we were attacked? That's what doesn't make sense. He took action, not sit under his desk in a fetal position.

If the FBI took all evidence of the attacks, then why was it all over our news and the whole world knew?

[Juniper]

Originally posted by Hanshilo
"a President is supposed to take action against the attackers that threatened his country." needs to shoot himself then lol...

So why would the FBI take off with tapes that show that there was nho sightings of a plane hitting the pentagon, i seriosly think somethings up with that...


Bud, the FBI isn't going to release all that information in a time of national security; we didn't know what was going on at the time. The FBI took quite a few tapes, one of their jobs in a national crisis is to investigate and handle the situation ASAP.

You will not mention harm coming to the leader of my country again or I will have this situation resolved by the moderating staff.

[Endra]

Hanshilo, please do not double post. I don't want to get any more involved in this (rather unnecessary) arguement than I already am.

[TakaTiger]

im not taking sides, but it highly possable that it is the goverment....and it is also possable that it was terrorists. but the only reason he is attacking the middle east right now is for their oil in my opinion, no "Weapons of mass destruction" have been found, or anything else they were looking for..... only oil :thinks:

[Hanshilo]

^
That was another good reson to get in there also another sign of been war hungry..

Mimicing goerge:-
(american tone)
"I am really scared... I am shocked(pause) That this would happen."
"Now i have declared war on..." so on soforth... "we must do this and that and make more problems" same with most ppl...
"blame al-queada, blame osama bin laden, blame him."
Maybe he should wake up and smell the coffee. "Maybe it just me."

I don't know you know...
Bout time something was done....
Especially what i belive.
I don't belive osama did it,
Hay Goerge may had even paid the Al-Queada to do it...

[Prince Simba]

Shame on y'all. This is definitely the most disrespectful thread I have ever seen posted anywhere.



But why would anyone want lie about it, it doesn't make sense how there was nothing to prove a plane had crashed, and then the pentagon had been hit by something too, apparentl a boieng 57 i thinkl it was, and yet it was just a hole, nothing compared to the twin towers where I swear that was not a normal plane, that was definatly a fighter jet... i mean what was in the box covered in blue sheets, where was the debrie of the plane that hit the pentagon, why would bin laden want to hit the towers, I don't believe someone like that would want to hurt innocent ppl, but then again, wouldn't stop goerge, i mean as it said on the video, it was planned to much lika a demolition, But i know alot of ppl that think that none on lea, that i know of...

You don't think someone like Bin Laden would want to hurt innocent people? That is probably the most confused statement ever.



In addition to Ghalati's statement (for those of you who don't understand why the Pentagon didn't collapse like the WTC), the Pentagon (five stories tall) is architectured much differently than a 100+ story skyscraper.

Like pntbll said, the government couldn't pull off Watergate. Even top-secret documents find their way onto public television. Do you think that in 5 years, we would have heard nothing about this? How naive are you to believe everything you hear?

This entire thread is crap, and I'll be damned if I'm ever going to have to put up with things like this.

How could you believe that a government and nation that has stood for freedom and individuality for over 200 years could suddenly turn around and do something like this?

There is no doubt in my mind that wherever KTL found that video, somebody was either trying to make a joke or piss people off. This is just like that Bonsai Kitten thing and you'd have to be a complete fool to believe it.

I have lost any respect I had regained in this forum and I probably won't be around for very much longer.

Edit:



You will not mention harm coming to the leader of my country again or I will have this situation resolved by the moderating staff.


That goes for me as well.


Edit 2:

KTL, I am very disappointed in you. You're much too intelligent to listen to this crap.

[Juniper]

@ Hanshilo:

This is not an argument about America, this is an argument about who blew up the WTC, Pentagon, and another aircraft. Not finding Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq has nothing to do with the 9/11 attacks; quit insulting my country with your trash. I am insulted, to say the least, and I would imagine any other American would be as well. This thread has done nothing but show ignorance; I think I've stated my opinion, and the facts, well enough. Now I'll tell you again, quit insulting my country.


Are you familiar with the concept of Doublethink?

[Bahati]

Five minutes of skimming through the video convinced me the entire thing's a load of crock. A foundation formed of fiction and fallacy won't stand up against even the lightest scrutiny.